Can I make a suggestions for July's discussion?

[Tazzie]

I'm curious, how many of us know the shot that we're looking for and then have the expertise to actually get it?

I seem to be in a constant cycle of "trying to do something different" but definitely do not have the understanding or expertise to capture "it" - is that because I actually am not sure what I really want so inevitably find failure?

Or do you just grab whatever opportunities present themselves?

[Cussy]

Tazzie,
Unless I know 100% what is going to be there, I don't have "a" shot. There are a range of shots maybe, but not a single thing. This way I wont be disappointed.

Saying that though there were one or two dives at St Abbs recently where I had an idea. On one I wanted some really good close-up and abstracts of Plumose anemones. I nailed that one as there were plenty around. I also did a dive looking for subjects to back light. While I had ideas I didn't exactly know what to expect, so this was more of an idea than a true vision.

I recently did a dive at Stoney where I had an image in mind. I wanted to mess around with long exposures, so I added a tripod. I didn't achieve what I wanted (a really good natural light shot of the Stanegarth), but I learned enough in that dive that I'm confident I can nail it next time.

So I'd say it's far easier to get what you visualise if it's static (like Plumose or wrecks), but when it comes to fish or anything that moves you rely quite a lot on luck, so this is when you need an idea of "if I see a crab I'll try X", "if I see a fish I'll do Y", "if the vis is so shocking I'll do self-portraits" etc

I'm only just getting into the realm of coming up with ideas and following them through. I find this approach can be disappointing though.
Rob

[jackdiver]

Originally Posted by Tazzie

I'm curious, how many of us know the shot that we're looking for and then have the expertise to actually get it?

Or do you just grab whatever opportunities present themselves?

I don't tend to go for a particular shot, which is just as well, as I still trying to get to grips with my set up. So definitely the latter.

I'm happy if the image in the review screen matches image in mind when I press the shutter release.

Most of the time it doesn't...

[TimIngmire]

Good Discussion Topic Tazzie!

I have to say that I still jump in with an opportunistic approach unless I know exaclty what I'm going to see eg the Cuttlefish dives at Babbacombe where I have a expectation based on good or poor visibility (detail and features if the former and the whole thing in it's environment if the latter).

It's good to have a view of the subject that you want and how to shoot it as Rob says above not only so that you know what to do when you come across them but you will infact notice those opportunities more often. Here's an example of how this applies on land in normal life - 1st read a local newspaper then read it again with something particular in mind (now you need help here so that somebody can suggest something to you after the first read) eg washing machines. You'll be surprised how many references to 'washing machines' you missed but were there all along - same with shots and diving, have a selection of shots in mind and you will be more tuned into seeing them when they are infront of you.

The other thing to say is not to look for subjects per se but look for ideal conditions and shoot whatever subject swims in (I'm sure you'll have heard Martin discuss this). Those ideal conditions maybe a perfect bit of hard coral and waiting for a blenny or whatever to swim in, a nice shapely gaps in weeds / rocks for fish to swim into or even lightbeams, dappled light etc. To do this means a good knowledge of the best feature of a site - or at least a cursory knowledge - so that you drop in, get to the spot and wait for the opportunity to puch the shutter.

I think imagining a shot from scratch i actually very difficult to do, looking at lots of other photo's should give you inspiration tho.

I'd like to see GLOC's pov on this given the images he takes

[ATJ]

My approach is very much like Rob's. There are some sites where I know what I'll find and go with something specific in mind. e.g. weedy seadragons. But that may not be the only thing I see on the dive so I will be opportunistic for the rest of the dive.

Even when you know what will be there, the conditions aren't always right and you have to change your plan. I went to a site where there were sharks. I had a pretty good idea what I wanted to do - although I was going to do a bit of trial and error - and once I got there, my strobe sync cord decided not to work and I was pretty well stuck.

[Tazzie]

Originally Posted by Cussy

So I'd say it's far easier to get what you visualise if it's static (like Plumose or wrecks), but when it comes to fish or anything that moves you rely quite a lot on luck, so this is when you need an idea of "if I see a crab I'll try X", "if I see a fish I'll do Y", "if the vis is so shocking I'll do self-portraits" etc

I'm only just getting into the realm of coming up with ideas and following them through. I find this approach can be disappointing though.
Rob

Do you know I think you might have hit a nail on the head somewhere for me, since I've been using (or trying to use) a plan I find I'm taking very very few fish shots indeed, most of my images are more static, seahorses, nudis, coral vistas etc... Hmm I obviously need to be more flexible!

Originally Posted by TimIngmire

The other thing to say is not to look for subjects per se but look for ideal conditions and shoot whatever subject swims in (I'm sure you'll have heard Martin discuss this). Those ideal conditions maybe a perfect bit of hard coral and waiting for a blenny or whatever to swim in, a nice shapely gaps in weeds / rocks for fish to swim into or even lightbeams, dappled light etc. To do this means a good knowledge of the best feature of a site - or at least a cursory knowledge - so that you drop in, get to the spot and wait for the opportunity to puch the shutter.

Yes a technique I find particulalry dificult to adhere to as I'm still looking and planning on the "feature" in the shot I guess

Originally Posted by ATJ

My approach is very much like Rob's. There are some sites where I know what I'll find and go with something specific in mind. e.g. weedy seadragons. But that may not be the only thing I see on the dive so I will be opportunistic for the rest of the dive.

Even when you know what will be there, the conditions aren't always right and you have to change your plan. I went to a site where there were sharks. I had a pretty good idea what I wanted to do - although I was going to do a bit of trial and error - and once I got there, my strobe sync cord decided not to work and I was pretty well stuck.

Oooo where are your weedy's? They're on my list for when I visit Oz later this year!!


Definitely having knowledge of a site is important isn't it. I guess I started the discussion cos of the Splash in in a couple of weeks, I know very little about Plymouth and it's sites and wondered how other people come up with a plan, or if they don't!

[Cussy]

Originally Posted by Tazzie

I guess I started the discussion cos of the Splash in in a couple of weeks, I know very little about Plymouth and it's sites and wondered how other people come up with a plan, or if they don't!

Tazzie,
Now you might understand why I'm diving the Friday - it's about getting an idea of conditions, checking out sites and getting into gear for the Splash-in. I guess we'll be diving similar sites, if not identical ones, on the Saturday as I am the Friday. So if I get anything decent on Friday I'll try and re-do it Saturday. I should also have a good idea of what isn't working. I've not been to Plymouth for a couple of years so want to check out what it's like.
Rob

[whacky]

My plan is to get to know my new set-up.

Had a go in the pool today with a rast from jamaica with a bo of grass. Sadly he couldn't stand up so i didn't get many shots.

I haven't got as far as thinking about what I'm doing on a dive as I don't generally dive with fellow photographers so it tends to be grab what I can.

I will watch this thread with interest

[ATJ]

Originally Posted by Tazzie

Oooo where are your weedy's? They're on my list for when I visit Oz later this year!!

There are quite a few spots around Sydney where they are found.

I have personally seen them at

* Shelly Beach, near Manly: e.g. Dive at Shelly Beach, Manly, NSW on 19/08/2007 - ATJ's Diving Site
* Bare Island, La Perouse: e.g. Dive at Bare Island, La Perouse, NSW on 11/03/2007 - ATJ's Diving Site
* The Monument, Kurnell: e.g. Dive at The Monument, Kurnell, NSW, Australia on 13/04/2008 - ATJ's Diving Site

I think Shelly Beach tends to be the best place to photograph them as there is "usually" less particulate matter in the water.

Michael McFadyen lists some other sites.

[Tazzie]

Originally Posted by Cussy

Tazzie,
Now you might understand why I'm diving the Friday - it's about getting an idea of conditions, checking out sites and getting into gear for the Splash-in. I guess we'll be diving similar sites, if not identical ones, on the Saturday as I am the Friday. So if I get anything decent on Friday I'll try and re-do it Saturday. I should also have a good idea of what isn't working. I've not been to Plymouth for a couple of years so want to check out what it's like.
Rob

Makes alot of sense Rob, I only know (and to be fair I don't "know" it really, I've dived it once and have seen lots of photos of it!) the JEL down there - any chance we can do that? LOL! (I am joking, I'm happy in 5m of water pootling along!)

Originally Posted by ATJ

There are quite a few spots around Sydney where they are found.

I have personally seen them at

* Shelly Beach, near Manly: e.g. Dive at Shelly Beach, Manly, NSW on 19/08/2007 - ATJ's Diving Site
* Bare Island, La Perouse: e.g. Dive at Bare Island, La Perouse, NSW on 11/03/2007 - ATJ's Diving Site
* The Monument, Kurnell: e.g. Dive at The Monument, Kurnell, NSW, Australia on 13/04/2008 - ATJ's Diving Site

I think Shelly Beach tends to be the best place to photograph them as there is "usually" less particulate matter in the water.

Michael McFadyen lists some other sites.

You're an absolute star, many thanks indeed

Apologies for taking the thread off topic


So are the "top" photographers ging in with a plan and sticking to it?